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  #11  
Old February 8th, 2015, 07:47 PM
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Concentrate flow is always way lower then the permeate flow. If you pinch down on the amount of concentrate leaving the vessel your permeate flow should increase and that is what you want. High permeate flow and low concentrate.

Your talking higher concentrate flow which is not the way a membrane works.
HIGH PERMEATE FLOW AND low concentrate flow is what your looking for.
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Old February 8th, 2015, 08:16 PM
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You will need to have recurculation going to do that on that style ro. You are not getting enough flow across the membrane to keep it clean. Open the recurculation valve up...
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Old February 8th, 2015, 08:38 PM
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Could the plug be in the wrong end of the membrane or the rubber seal that can only go in one way?
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Old February 8th, 2015, 08:51 PM
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It does have a U cup. I am leaning towards it may be in backwards.
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Old February 8th, 2015, 09:04 PM
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That's the name U cup. bypassing because its the path of least resistance.
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Old February 8th, 2015, 09:26 PM
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You should be flowing across the membrane surface at around 70 gpm. A 4" membrane requires 14gpm across the membrane surface to keep it clean. You are running a 8" at 7 gal/min. Increasing your pressure is only pluggine the membrane harder. If you dont have flow across the surface, keep the pressure down.

What flow rates do you get haynes if your recirculation pump turned off?
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Old February 9th, 2015, 12:14 AM
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I don't know because my CDL turns on all pumps with one switch. I will admit I don't play with the flow rates much after its running. I check for sugar in the permeate and let it do its thing.
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Old February 9th, 2015, 05:38 PM
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Had a 2k word explination typed up but when went to add pic I couldn't close tab. Mainly a u cup is put on over the u cup "o ring" on the end of membrane this is mainly used in the aid of sap recirculation within the vessel as it directs the flow of sap across the pores to keep them open for higher flow rates.

I have before removed the u cup o ring and placed it on the other end of the membrane and put back in vessel and ran like that for a few minutes. So yes it was against what you would say is the opposite flow and benchmark flow rates were very close.

Yes sapoholic if you unplug your recirculation pump after concentrating for a while within 30-45 seconds MAX your total flow rates across the membrane will be just about cut in 1/2. Know I posted this before but guess I need to do a YouTube video to convince some.

If Brandon does not have an auxiliary motor of some sort ( for true recirculation) then I'm not even sure why he has a plastic u cup? I'm guessing that he needs to install membrane with the rubber u cup o ring up on the top of the vessel like the 2.5" and 4" guys do. Some that o ring on top is somewhat tight to the sides of the vessel and forces the sap straight into the end of the membrane.
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Old February 9th, 2015, 06:27 PM
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I did talk to Ray this am and my RO is different than the 125, 250 and 375 units which is about what everyone on here that has Deer Run RO's are running. On my paticular model, it is designed to run at 350 PSI and the bypass/recirulation valve has to be opened about 1/4 of a turn. The smaller units, that isn't neccessary but it is on my. Of course, nothing in his instructions that say anything about this. I took 825 gallons of sap down to 130 gallons of concentrate in about 2.25 hours and no sugar passage. That is somewhere around 11 to 12 percent as I didn't test the final concentrate. I have been in discussion with him about a nice instruction manual complete with pictures and diagrams. Also, may do a video or maybe one for each model and post them so others can view them. It will be sometime later in the year before this happens but this way manuals can be emailed to someone along with a brochure, prices, etc. Instructional videos will be a big plus to the user also if we can do those.
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  #20  
Old February 9th, 2015, 07:28 PM
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Sap through the season may dictate what PSI you want to run at. If one thinks that 350 is set it and leave it/good luck on membrane flow rates and potential life shortening of the membrane. If someone keeps raming late season sap with high bacterial loads you will keep the membrane manufactures happy for sure.

Some Ro's can operate at 150 psi and still be effective just that your flow rates are diminished. Over time one will certainly know what is good for the membrane and what is bad and it may cost them a barrel of syrup to find out.

A Friend of mine in VT always says on someone flubbing up= " It's all part if growing up"
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